Re: merging mono files

Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1927 bytes --]

Hi guys,

I cannot interact directly on the mailing list for some reason and had 
to post my question via email.

I have just installed SoX and upon running it I only get a back window 
appearing momentarily and then vanishes. Consider me a complete noob and 
treat me with some patience.

I need to combine several mono wav samples to corresponding stereo 
files. I am running Windows 10 not linux. The files are in folder and 
named as as follows:

Basson16L
....rel00150
........036-C
........037-C#
........038-D
........etc
....rel00600
........036-C
........037-C#
........038-D
........etc
....rel99999
........036-C
........037-C#
........038-D
........etc
036-C
037-C#
038-D
etc


Basson16R
....rel00150
........036-C
........037-C#
........038-D
........etc
....rel00600
........036-C
........037-C#
........038-D
........etc
....rel99999
........036-C
........037-C#
........038-D
........etc
036-C
037-C#
038-D
etc

Each subfolder has similarly names files as shown.

I need to merge corresponding lefts and rights to output as new stereo 
files in new folders bearing the original name of the instrument (organ 
stop in this case) and subfolders and I want to ensure the appropriate 
files are merged together. Identical names exist in the subfolders that 
bear the release/ tail of a wave profile because each must correspond to 
the corresponding main file when eventually played in the appropriate 
software. Those of you who may have processed sound files for jOrgan, 
GrandOrgue or Hauptwerk know what I am talking about.

How do I get to use SoX for this exercise. Total files I need to process 
run into 2000+ mono files x 2 to get 2000+ stereo files. That's a lot to 
process manually!!!

I hope that loops and markers (cues) are not erased in the process!!!

Regards
Mark
(marcusfb(at)gmail.com)




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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 4635 bytes --]

Hi Peter,

Thanks for your reply. Been there, done that. I figured out how to open 
cmd prompt and set the path.

What I now wish to know is what "code" do I put into a .txt file which I 
would then change to .bat in order to achieve what I need to achieve?

Regards

Mark



On 07/12/2016 22:07, Peter P. wrote:
> * Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> [2016-12-07 20:54]:
>> Hi guys,
> Hi Dr. Mark
>   
>> I cannot interact directly on the mailing list for some reason and had to
>> post my question via email.
> This is how mailing lists work. You post your question by mail, others
> read it and respond via mail (which is what I am doing).
>   
>> I have just installed SoX and upon running it I only get a back window
>> appearing momentarily and then vanishes. Consider me a complete noob and
>> treat me with some patience.
> SoX is a program that you run in a comman line window. Depending on the
> operating system you are on you have to open a terminal window
> (sometimes called shell) and type commands in there. SoX is one of the
> commands you type.
> An ixquick.com internet search gave the following webpage as third
> result: https://github.com/JoFrhwld/FAVE/wiki/Sox-on-Windows
> This, combined with the following instructions how to open that terminal
> window (aka shell aka command prompt)
> http://www.howtogeek.com/235101/10-ways-to-open-the-command-prompt-in-windows-10/
> should get you going. Try to combine two mono files to one stereo file
> as a first example. You might have to get into some shell scripting.
> Feel free to report back to this list if basic sox operation is still
> not working after you read both sites.
>
> cheers, P
>   
>> I need to combine several mono wav samples to corresponding stereo files. I
>> am running Windows 10 not linux. The files are in folder and named as as
>> follows:
>>
>> Basson16L
>> ....rel00150
>> ........036-C
>> ........037-C#
>> ........038-D
>> ........etc
>> ....rel00600
>> ........036-C
>> ........037-C#
>> ........038-D
>> ........etc
>> ....rel99999
>> ........036-C
>> ........037-C#
>> ........038-D
>> ........etc
>> 036-C
>> 037-C#
>> 038-D
>> etc
>>
>>
>> Basson16R
>> ....rel00150
>> ........036-C
>> ........037-C#
>> ........038-D
>> ........etc
>> ....rel00600
>> ........036-C
>> ........037-C#
>> ........038-D
>> ........etc
>> ....rel99999
>> ........036-C
>> ........037-C#
>> ........038-D
>> ........etc
>> 036-C
>> 037-C#
>> 038-D
>> etc
>>
>> Each subfolder has similarly names files as shown.
>>
>> I need to merge corresponding lefts and rights to output as new stereo files
>> in new folders bearing the original name of the instrument (organ stop in
>> this case) and subfolders and I want to ensure the appropriate files are
>> merged together. Identical names exist in the subfolders that bear the
>> release/ tail of a wave profile because each must correspond to the
>> corresponding main file when eventually played in the appropriate software.
>> Those of you who may have processed sound files for jOrgan, GrandOrgue or
>> Hauptwerk know what I am talking about.
>>
>> How do I get to use SoX for this exercise. Total files I need to process run
>> into 2000+ mono files x 2 to get 2000+ stereo files. That's a lot to process
>> manually!!!
>>
>> I hope that loops and markers (cues) are not erased in the process!!!
>>
>> Regards
>> Mark
>> (marcusfb(at)gmail.com)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ---
>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
>> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
>> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
>> Training and support from Colfax.
>> Order your platform today.http://sdm.link/xeonphi
>> _______________________________________________
>> Sox-users mailing list
>> Sox-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/sox-users
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
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> Training and support from Colfax.
> Order your platform today.http://sdm.link/xeonphi
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Re: merging mono files

[Peter P.]

* Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> [2016-12-07 20:54]:
> Hi guys,
Hi Dr. Mark
 
> I cannot interact directly on the mailing list for some reason and had to
> post my question via email.
This is how mailing lists work. You post your question by mail, others
read it and respond via mail (which is what I am doing).
 
> I have just installed SoX and upon running it I only get a back window
> appearing momentarily and then vanishes. Consider me a complete noob and
> treat me with some patience.
SoX is a program that you run in a comman line window. Depending on the
operating system you are on you have to open a terminal window
(sometimes called shell) and type commands in there. SoX is one of the
commands you type.
An ixquick.com internet search gave the following webpage as third
result: https://github.com/JoFrhwld/FAVE/wiki/Sox-on-Windows
This, combined with the following instructions how to open that terminal
window (aka shell aka command prompt)
http://www.howtogeek.com/235101/10-ways-to-open-the-command-prompt-in-windows-10/
should get you going. Try to combine two mono files to one stereo file
as a first example. You might have to get into some shell scripting.
Feel free to report back to this list if basic sox operation is still
not working after you read both sites.

cheers, P
 
> I need to combine several mono wav samples to corresponding stereo files. I
> am running Windows 10 not linux. The files are in folder and named as as
> follows:
> 
> Basson16L
> ....rel00150
> ........036-C
> ........037-C#
> ........038-D
> ........etc
> ....rel00600
> ........036-C
> ........037-C#
> ........038-D
> ........etc
> ....rel99999
> ........036-C
> ........037-C#
> ........038-D
> ........etc
> 036-C
> 037-C#
> 038-D
> etc
> 
> 
> Basson16R
> ....rel00150
> ........036-C
> ........037-C#
> ........038-D
> ........etc
> ....rel00600
> ........036-C
> ........037-C#
> ........038-D
> ........etc
> ....rel99999
> ........036-C
> ........037-C#
> ........038-D
> ........etc
> 036-C
> 037-C#
> 038-D
> etc
> 
> Each subfolder has similarly names files as shown.
> 
> I need to merge corresponding lefts and rights to output as new stereo files
> in new folders bearing the original name of the instrument (organ stop in
> this case) and subfolders and I want to ensure the appropriate files are
> merged together. Identical names exist in the subfolders that bear the
> release/ tail of a wave profile because each must correspond to the
> corresponding main file when eventually played in the appropriate software.
> Those of you who may have processed sound files for jOrgan, GrandOrgue or
> Hauptwerk know what I am talking about.
> 
> How do I get to use SoX for this exercise. Total files I need to process run
> into 2000+ mono files x 2 to get 2000+ stereo files. That's a lot to process
> manually!!!
> 
> I hope that loops and markers (cues) are not erased in the process!!!
> 
> Regards
> Mark
> (marcusfb(at)gmail.com)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
> Training and support from Colfax.
> Order your platform today.http://sdm.link/xeonphi

> _______________________________________________
> Sox-users mailing list
> Sox-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/sox-users


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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 4445 bytes --]

jOrgan and GrandOrgue fora (both on sourceforge too) work differently.

Regards
Mark

On 07/12/2016 22:07, Peter P. wrote:
> * Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> [2016-12-07 20:54]:
>> Hi guys,
> Hi Dr. Mark
>   
>> I cannot interact directly on the mailing list for some reason and had to
>> post my question via email.
> This is how mailing lists work. You post your question by mail, others
> read it and respond via mail (which is what I am doing).
>   
>> I have just installed SoX and upon running it I only get a back window
>> appearing momentarily and then vanishes. Consider me a complete noob and
>> treat me with some patience.
> SoX is a program that you run in a comman line window. Depending on the
> operating system you are on you have to open a terminal window
> (sometimes called shell) and type commands in there. SoX is one of the
> commands you type.
> An ixquick.com internet search gave the following webpage as third
> result: https://github.com/JoFrhwld/FAVE/wiki/Sox-on-Windows
> This, combined with the following instructions how to open that terminal
> window (aka shell aka command prompt)
> http://www.howtogeek.com/235101/10-ways-to-open-the-command-prompt-in-windows-10/
> should get you going. Try to combine two mono files to one stereo file
> as a first example. You might have to get into some shell scripting.
> Feel free to report back to this list if basic sox operation is still
> not working after you read both sites.
>
> cheers, P
>   
>> I need to combine several mono wav samples to corresponding stereo files. I
>> am running Windows 10 not linux. The files are in folder and named as as
>> follows:
>>
>> Basson16L
>> ....rel00150
>> ........036-C
>> ........037-C#
>> ........038-D
>> ........etc
>> ....rel00600
>> ........036-C
>> ........037-C#
>> ........038-D
>> ........etc
>> ....rel99999
>> ........036-C
>> ........037-C#
>> ........038-D
>> ........etc
>> 036-C
>> 037-C#
>> 038-D
>> etc
>>
>>
>> Basson16R
>> ....rel00150
>> ........036-C
>> ........037-C#
>> ........038-D
>> ........etc
>> ....rel00600
>> ........036-C
>> ........037-C#
>> ........038-D
>> ........etc
>> ....rel99999
>> ........036-C
>> ........037-C#
>> ........038-D
>> ........etc
>> 036-C
>> 037-C#
>> 038-D
>> etc
>>
>> Each subfolder has similarly names files as shown.
>>
>> I need to merge corresponding lefts and rights to output as new stereo files
>> in new folders bearing the original name of the instrument (organ stop in
>> this case) and subfolders and I want to ensure the appropriate files are
>> merged together. Identical names exist in the subfolders that bear the
>> release/ tail of a wave profile because each must correspond to the
>> corresponding main file when eventually played in the appropriate software.
>> Those of you who may have processed sound files for jOrgan, GrandOrgue or
>> Hauptwerk know what I am talking about.
>>
>> How do I get to use SoX for this exercise. Total files I need to process run
>> into 2000+ mono files x 2 to get 2000+ stereo files. That's a lot to process
>> manually!!!
>>
>> I hope that loops and markers (cues) are not erased in the process!!!
>>
>> Regards
>> Mark
>> (marcusfb(at)gmail.com)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ---
>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
>> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
>> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
>> Training and support from Colfax.
>> Order your platform today.http://sdm.link/xeonphi
>> _______________________________________________
>> Sox-users mailing list
>> Sox-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/sox-users
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
> Training and support from Colfax.
> Order your platform today.http://sdm.link/xeonphi
> _______________________________________________
> Sox-users mailing list
> Sox-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/sox-users
>



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Re: merging mono files

[Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users]

On 2016-12-07 22:27, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
> jOrgan and GrandOrgue fora (both on sourceforge too) work differently.

Do you mean, "differently from this mail list"?   They would do, as this 
is
a mail list not a forum.


Apart from the way of merging two mono files into a stereo file, you 
also said
originally:

>>> I hope that loops and markers (cues) are not erased in the process!!!


I think you need to explain what you mean by that. I would expect audio 
files
processed by sox to contain just audio data; I don't understand how one 
could
contain loop or marker information, and therefore I also don't 
understand how
you could possibly expect sox to conserve such information.

Are all your audio files prepared in exactly the same way?

Are they all of exactly the same length, or failing that, are each of 
the pairs
you want to merge all of the same length?

Are each pair also at the same sampling rate, bit depth and volume, or 
will
differences in those respects need to be solved first?




-- 
Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own

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Re: merging mono files

[Peter P.]

* Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> [2016-12-07 22:08]:
> Hi Peter,
> 
> Thanks for your reply. Been there, done that. I figured out how to open cmd
> prompt and set the path.
And I hope you can try simple sox examples such as 
 sox input.wav output.wav reverb
etc.
 
> What I now wish to know is what "code" do I put into a .txt file which I
> would then change to .bat in order to achieve what I need to achieve?
I am afraid I can not be of great help here, as I am on Linux where you
would do it with something like

for a in dir1/*.wav; do sox -M dir1/"$a" dir2/"$a" dir3/"$a"; done 

(though this is untested and might not even be the precise syntax that
would work on Linux)
In the above example it is assumed that all left-channel files are in
directory dir1, the right channels in dir2 and that an output directory
dir3 exists.

Now I don't know how that is done in the windows command window, but you
might search ixquick.com for "dos run command on all files in directory"
which in my case yields something like
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/180741/how-to-do-something-to-each-file-in-a-directory-with-a-batch-script
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/14237548/batch-script-run-command-on-each-file-in-directory
etc.
and work on from there.

Or some windows users from this list might be able to help out.

cheers, P

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Re: merging mono files

[Peter P.]

* Peter P. <peterparker@fastmail.com> [2016-12-08 01:07]:
[...] 
> Now I don't know how that is done in the windows command window, but you
> might search ixquick.com for "dos run command on all files in directory"
> which in my case yields something like
> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/180741/how-to-do-something-to-each-file-in-a-directory-with-a-batch-script
> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/14237548/batch-script-run-command-on-each-file-in-directory

Or look at
http://sox.sourceforge.net/Docs/Scripts
or 
https://superuser.com/questions/489024/run-sox-batch-on-files-in-a-relative-folder



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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2061 bytes --]

I wish I can send you a photo... but if I did the message will get 
delayed by moderators as the first message I sent did and is still 
awaiting moderation!

The fora I mentioned are also mailing-lists so one has 2 options by way 
of which to post.

The mono pairs match in every way. They were processed by a friend who 
has since passed away and he must have processed them as stereo samples 
then separated them in preparation for Hauptwerk software with tremmed 
samples included too. I am not interested in tremmed samples and for all 
intents and purposes I need the pairs matched up again so that they can 
be used for all 3 major software: jOrgan, GrandOrgue and even Hauptwerk 
itself.

The loops and releases are there already and visible in Sony Soundforge 
and all pairs of samples match in this respect too.

Regards

Mark


On 08/12/2016 00:05, Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users wrote:
> On 2016-12-07 22:27, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
>> jOrgan and GrandOrgue fora (both on sourceforge too) work differently.
> Do you mean, "differently from this mail list"?   They would do, as this
> is
> a mail list not a forum.
>
>
> Apart from the way of merging two mono files into a stereo file, you
> also said
> originally:
>
>>>> I hope that loops and markers (cues) are not erased in the process!!!
>
> I think you need to explain what you mean by that. I would expect audio
> files
> processed by sox to contain just audio data; I don't understand how one
> could
> contain loop or marker information, and therefore I also don't
> understand how
> you could possibly expect sox to conserve such information.
>
> Are all your audio files prepared in exactly the same way?
>
> Are they all of exactly the same length, or failing that, are each of
> the pairs
> you want to merge all of the same length?
>
> Are each pair also at the same sampling rate, bit depth and volume, or
> will
> differences in those respects need to be solved first?
>
>
>
>



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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1442 bytes --]

I am trying to understand all the lingo but not getting anywhere. It 
would be simpler for me to try and understand Chinese written backwards 
and upside-down!

Mark


On 08/12/2016 01:09, Peter P. wrote:
> * Peter P. <peterparker@fastmail.com> [2016-12-08 01:07]:
> [...]
>> Now I don't know how that is done in the windows command window, but you
>> might search ixquick.com for "dos run command on all files in directory"
>> which in my case yields something like
>> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/180741/how-to-do-something-to-each-file-in-a-directory-with-a-batch-script
>> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/14237548/batch-script-run-command-on-each-file-in-directory
> Or look at
> http://sox.sourceforge.net/Docs/Scripts
> or
> https://superuser.com/questions/489024/run-sox-batch-on-files-in-a-relative-folder
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
> Training and support from Colfax.
> Order your platform today.http://sdm.link/xeonphi
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>



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Re: merging mono files

[Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users]

On 2016-12-08 00:34, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
> I am trying to understand all the lingo but not getting anywhere. It
> would be simpler for me to try and understand Chinese written
> backwards and upside-down!

First, forget about trying to do all the files automatically.  You need 
to
find, by trial and error, issuing commands in a command window, a 
command
that will take one pair of mono files and produce the merged result you
expect, in the place you expect.

Next, do you have any experience of writing scripts or programs in any 
programming
language?  If you do, it's probably easier to develop a script/program 
in a
language you understand.  If you don't then someone will be able to show 
you how
to adapt the command you find for one pair of files, to work for a 
subset or
even perhaps all of your files.


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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2310 bytes --]

Manually I was able to open a pair of files in Sony Soundforge. Copy the 
right channel from the R file and simply paste it into the blank channel 
in the L file. Save. Done. Loops and markers are all left intact.

This is the process I'd like to emulate and automate for a number of 
file pairs. I can handle modification of a bat file to specify different 
pairs of folders and do a "rank" (instrument or stop) at a time. I can 
batch process renaming of the files. It's the code that I need to create 
an appropriate bat file to merge pairs of files from 2 folders. I did 
find "codes" to do this but I don't understand which parts I would need 
to modify, if at all, to direct the process to my named folders and the 
files within.

Folder 1 may be called *TrumpetL*

Folder 2 may be called *TrumpetR*

In each, there are files with identical names: 036-C.wav, 037-C#.wav, 
038-D.wav, 039-D#.wav, 040-E.wav.................. 096-C.wav

Pairing would involve merging the files sharing the same name, one from 
each of the two folders, eg 036-C.wav from folder *TrumpetL *with 
036-C.wav from folder *TrumpetR *so that the output file would be 
036-C.wav (now a stereo file following the merger) into a folder *Trumpet*.

What code would I need to achieve this? That's what I am after.


On 08/12/2016 02:01, Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users wrote:
> On 2016-12-08 00:34, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
>> I am trying to understand all the lingo but not getting anywhere. It
>> would be simpler for me to try and understand Chinese written
>> backwards and upside-down!
> First, forget about trying to do all the files automatically.  You need
> to
> find, by trial and error, issuing commands in a command window, a
> command
> that will take one pair of mono files and produce the merged result you
> expect, in the place you expect.
>
> Next, do you have any experience of writing scripts or programs in any
> programming
> language?  If you do, it's probably easier to develop a script/program
> in a
> language you understand.  If you don't then someone will be able to show
> you how
> to adapt the command you find for one pair of files, to work for a
> subset or
> even perhaps all of your files.
>
>



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Re: merging mono files

[Kevin Conder]

On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 1:52 PM, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi guys,
>
> I cannot interact directly on the mailing list for some reason and had to post my question via email.
>
> I have just installed SoX and upon running it I only get a back window appearing momentarily and then vanishes. Consider me a complete noob and treat me with some patience.
>
> I need to combine several mono wav samples to corresponding stereo files. I am running Windows 10 not linux. The files are in folder and named as as follows:
>
> I need to merge corresponding lefts and rights to output as new stereo files in new folders bearing the original name of the instrument (organ stop in this case) and subfolders and I want to ensure the appropriate files are merged together. Identical names exist in the subfolders that bear the release/ tail of a wave profile because each must correspond to the corresponding main file when eventually played in the appropriate software. Those of you who may have processed sound files for jOrgan, GrandOrgue or Hauptwerk know what I am talking about.
>
> How do I get to use SoX for this exercise. Total files I need to process run into 2000+ mono files x 2 to get 2000+ stereo files. That's a lot to process manually!!!
>

Let's break your question into two parts: combining two 1-channel
audio files into one 2-channel audio file and scripting this
combination with multiple files in different directories.

There is one caveat: I don't have access to Windows 10, I'm using Windows 7.

1. Does this sox command work for combining two 1-channel files,
left.wav and right.wav, into one 2-channel audio file: stereo.wav?

sox -M -c 1 left.wav -c 1 right.wav stereo.wav



2. I would use a scripting language to work with multiple files in
different directories. Do you have Windows Script Host available on
your system?

a. Go to the command prompt. (Search for "Command Prompt" or "cmd.exe".)

b. At the command prompt, type this command:

cscript.exe

If the command returns an error, you don't have Windows Script Host
installed. If you do have it installed, let's see if you can create
and run a VBScript program. Type this command:

notepad hello.vbs

This will bring up the Notepad text editor for a VBScript program
called hello.vbs. Type the following text into Notepad, then save and
close it:

Wscript.Echo "Hello, World!"

To run the hello.vbs VBScript program, type the following command at
the command prompt:

cscript hello.vbs

The command prompt should display "Hello, World!". Let me know if
you're able to complete #1 and #2 to your satisfaction and I'll help
you combine the two to solve your problem.

-- 
Kevin Conder

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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

Hi,

I shall reply below:


On 08/12/2016 03:15, Kevin Conder wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 1:52 PM, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi guys,
>>
>> I cannot interact directly on the mailing list for some reason and had to post my question via email.
>>
>> I have just installed SoX and upon running it I only get a back window appearing momentarily and then vanishes. Consider me a complete noob and treat me with some patience.
>>
>> I need to combine several mono wav samples to corresponding stereo files. I am running Windows 10 not linux. The files are in folder and named as as follows:
>>
>> I need to merge corresponding lefts and rights to output as new stereo files in new folders bearing the original name of the instrument (organ stop in this case) and subfolders and I want to ensure the appropriate files are merged together. Identical names exist in the subfolders that bear the release/ tail of a wave profile because each must correspond to the corresponding main file when eventually played in the appropriate software. Those of you who may have processed sound files for jOrgan, GrandOrgue or Hauptwerk know what I am talking about.
>>
>> How do I get to use SoX for this exercise. Total files I need to process run into 2000+ mono files x 2 to get 2000+ stereo files. That's a lot to process manually!!!
>>
> Let's break your question into two parts: combining two 1-channel
> audio files into one 2-channel audio file and scripting this
> combination with multiple files in different directories.
>
> There is one caveat: I don't have access to Windows 10, I'm using Windows 7.
>
> 1. Does this sox command work for combining two 1-channel files,
> left.wav and right.wav, into one 2-channel audio file: stereo.wav?
>
> sox -M -c 1 left.wav -c 1 right.wav stereo.wav
The bat files seems to run with no error but the stereo file is not 
created. I am working within the sox folder calling the wav files left 
and right respectively and having created a Test.bat file and running it 
from cmd prompt:
c:\Program Files (x86)\sox-14-4-2>Test.bat
> 2. I would use a scripting language to work with multiple files in
> different directories. Do you have Windows Script Host available on
> your system?
>
> a. Go to the command prompt. (Search for "Command Prompt" or "cmd.exe".)
>
> b. At the command prompt, type this command:
>
> cscript.exe
Miocrosoft (R) Windows Script Host Version 5.812
> If the command returns an error, you don't have Windows Script Host
> installed. If you do have it installed, let's see if you can create
> and run a VBScript program. Type this command:
>
> notepad hello.vbs
>
> This will bring up the Notepad text editor for a VBScript program
> called hello.vbs. Type the following text into Notepad, then save and
> close it:
Done and saved on desktop.
> Wscript.Echo "Hello, World!"
>
> To run the hello.vbs VBScript program, type the following command at
> the command prompt:
>
> cscript hello.vbs
>
> The command prompt should display "Hello, World!". Let me know if
> you're able to complete #1 and #2 to your satisfaction and I'll help
> you combine the two to solve your problem.
No such message pops up. Instead cmd prompt window raises the error:
Input Error: Can not find script file "c:\hello.vbs"
But if I place the vbs file in the sox folder and run the cmd:
c:\Program Files (x86)\sox-14-4-2>cscript hello.vbs
then yes.... I get Hello, World! on the cmd window


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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 3123 bytes --]

I shifted the Test.bat, left.wav, right.wav in a subfolder called 
"input" (arbitrarily) and ran

c:\Program Files (x86)\sox-14-4-2\input>Test.bat

and YES I get a stereo.wav which appears correct on Soundforge!!!

Horrah!!


On 08/12/2016 03:15, Kevin Conder wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 1:52 PM, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi guys,
>>
>> I cannot interact directly on the mailing list for some reason and had to post my question via email.
>>
>> I have just installed SoX and upon running it I only get a back window appearing momentarily and then vanishes. Consider me a complete noob and treat me with some patience.
>>
>> I need to combine several mono wav samples to corresponding stereo files. I am running Windows 10 not linux. The files are in folder and named as as follows:
>>
>> I need to merge corresponding lefts and rights to output as new stereo files in new folders bearing the original name of the instrument (organ stop in this case) and subfolders and I want to ensure the appropriate files are merged together. Identical names exist in the subfolders that bear the release/ tail of a wave profile because each must correspond to the corresponding main file when eventually played in the appropriate software. Those of you who may have processed sound files for jOrgan, GrandOrgue or Hauptwerk know what I am talking about.
>>
>> How do I get to use SoX for this exercise. Total files I need to process run into 2000+ mono files x 2 to get 2000+ stereo files. That's a lot to process manually!!!
>>
> Let's break your question into two parts: combining two 1-channel
> audio files into one 2-channel audio file and scripting this
> combination with multiple files in different directories.
>
> There is one caveat: I don't have access to Windows 10, I'm using Windows 7.
>
> 1. Does this sox command work for combining two 1-channel files,
> left.wav and right.wav, into one 2-channel audio file: stereo.wav?
>
> sox -M -c 1 left.wav -c 1 right.wav stereo.wav
>
>
>
> 2. I would use a scripting language to work with multiple files in
> different directories. Do you have Windows Script Host available on
> your system?
>
> a. Go to the command prompt. (Search for "Command Prompt" or "cmd.exe".)
>
> b. At the command prompt, type this command:
>
> cscript.exe
>
> If the command returns an error, you don't have Windows Script Host
> installed. If you do have it installed, let's see if you can create
> and run a VBScript program. Type this command:
>
> notepad hello.vbs
>
> This will bring up the Notepad text editor for a VBScript program
> called hello.vbs. Type the following text into Notepad, then save and
> close it:
>
> Wscript.Echo "Hello, World!"
>
> To run the hello.vbs VBScript program, type the following command at
> the command prompt:
>
> cscript hello.vbs
>
> The command prompt should display "Hello, World!". Let me know if
> you're able to complete #1 and #2 to your satisfaction and I'll help
> you combine the two to solve your problem.
>



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Re: merging mono files

[Jan Stary]

On Dec 08 02:36:41, marcusfb@gmail.com wrote:
> Manually I was able to open a pair of files in Sony Soundforge. Copy the
> right channel from the R file and simply paste it into the blank channel in
> the L file. Save. Done. Loops and markers are all left intact.
> 
> This is the process I'd like to emulate and automate for a number of file
> pairs. I can handle modification of a bat file to specify different pairs of
> folders and do a "rank" (instrument or stop) at a time. I can batch process
> renaming of the files. It's the code that I need to create an appropriate
> bat file to merge pairs of files from 2 folders. I did find "codes" to do
> this but I don't understand which parts I would need to modify, if at all,
> to direct the process to my named folders and the files within.
> 
> Folder 1 may be called *TrumpetL*
> 
> Folder 2 may be called *TrumpetR*
> 
> In each, there are files with identical names: 036-C.wav, 037-C#.wav,
> 038-D.wav, 039-D#.wav, 040-E.wav.................. 096-C.wav
> 
> Pairing would involve merging the files sharing the same name, one from each
> of the two folders, eg 036-C.wav from folder *TrumpetL *with 036-C.wav from
> folder *TrumpetR *so that the output file would be 036-C.wav (now a stereo
> file following the merger) into a folder *Trumpet*.
> 
> What code would I need to achieve this? That's what I am after.

In a standard shell, you would do something like this

	for left in TrumpetL/*wav; do
		name=${left##*/}
		right=TrumpetR/$name
		sox -M $left $right stereo-$name
	done

The syntax of the Windows command line will be different of course.
Also, the above skips all error checking: does the correpsonding
right file exist for the left file? Did the SoX run succeed? etc.


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Re: merging mono files

[Jan Stary]

> >>> I hope that loops and markers (cues) are not erased in the process!!!
> 
> I think you need to explain what you mean by that. I would expect audio 
> files
> processed by sox to contain just audio data; I don't understand how one 
> could
> contain loop or marker information, and therefore I also don't 
> understand how
> you could possibly expect sox to conserve such information.

Some handheld recorders, for example, allow for saving "markers"
in the file. This is not inbetween the samples, obviously;
these are saved in the header.

A typical application of that is e.g. a journalist marking "next
question" or a field recording marking "next song". I have a ZOOM H1
recorder and a Microtrack II recorder which do that.

I believe SoX does preserve that information in the audio header,
but it's been a long time I checked so I am not sure.

What Mark has seem to be sampled trumpet notes,
so I don't know what kind of markers would that use and why,
but let's see what he reports.

	Jan


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Re: merging mono files

[Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users]

On 2016-12-08 07:12, Jan Stary wrote:

> Some handheld recorders, for example, allow for saving "markers"
> in the file. This is not inbetween the samples, obviously;
> these are saved in the header.

Ah, I see.

> A typical application of that is e.g. a journalist marking "next
> question" or a field recording marking "next song". I have a ZOOM H1
> recorder and a Microtrack II recorder which do that.

I've a Tascam HD-P2 which records on to a CF card.  If you look at that 
from
a computer, each project is a series of Take<nn>.wav files, plus two 
others:
settings.xml & markers.xml.  Clearly, for me, sox would never see the 
latter.


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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1013 bytes --]

If Sox does not preserve loops and cues yet.... then please add that to 
the wish list. It would be very handy for several people doing serious 
digital sound processing. :-)

Mark


On 08/12/2016 11:46, Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users wrote:
> On 2016-12-08 07:12, Jan Stary wrote:
>
>> Some handheld recorders, for example, allow for saving "markers"
>> in the file. This is not inbetween the samples, obviously;
>> these are saved in the header.
> Ah, I see.
>
>> A typical application of that is e.g. a journalist marking "next
>> question" or a field recording marking "next song". I have a ZOOM H1
>> recorder and a Microtrack II recorder which do that.
> I've a Tascam HD-P2 which records on to a CF card.  If you look at that
> from
> a computer, each project is a series of Take<nn>.wav files, plus two
> others:
> settings.xml & markers.xml.  Clearly, for me, sox would never see the
> latter.
>
>



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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1768 bytes --]

I sent an email with a picture.... again it is being held for 
moderation..... :-(


On 08/12/2016 08:12, Jan Stary wrote:
>>>>> I hope that loops and markers (cues) are not erased in the process!!!
>> I think you need to explain what you mean by that. I would expect audio
>> files
>> processed by sox to contain just audio data; I don't understand how one
>> could
>> contain loop or marker information, and therefore I also don't
>> understand how
>> you could possibly expect sox to conserve such information.
> Some handheld recorders, for example, allow for saving "markers"
> in the file. This is not inbetween the samples, obviously;
> these are saved in the header.
>
> A typical application of that is e.g. a journalist marking "next
> question" or a field recording marking "next song". I have a ZOOM H1
> recorder and a Microtrack II recorder which do that.
>
> I believe SoX does preserve that information in the audio header,
> but it's been a long time I checked so I am not sure.
>
> What Mark has seem to be sampled trumpet notes,
> so I don't know what kind of markers would that use and why,
> but let's see what he reports.
>
> 	Jan
>
>
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Re: merging mono files

[Peter P.]

* Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> [2016-12-08 12:02]:
> I sent an email with a picture.... again it is being held for
> moderation..... :-(
Don't send picture attachments to email lists until you absolutely have
to. Try to describe your problem in words which are then also readable
by visually impaired.

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Re: merging mono files

[Peter P.]

* Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> [2016-12-08 12:00]:
> If Sox does not preserve loops and cues yet.... then please add that to the
> wish list. It would be very handy for several people doing serious digital
> sound processing. :-)
I was thinking about the problem of markers in the file headers when
mixing files together, as Dr. Mark is trying to do. What if the
markers in the left channel and the right channel are not completely
identical? I think this is a more complicated task than just copying
input file markers to the output file when mixing.

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Re: merging mono files

[Erich Eckner]

[-- Attachment #1.1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 985 bytes --]

On 08.12.2016 12:45, Peter P. wrote:
> * Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> [2016-12-08 12:00]:
>> If Sox does not preserve loops and cues yet.... then please add that to the
>> wish list. It would be very handy for several people doing serious digital
>> sound processing. :-)
> I was thinking about the problem of markers in the file headers when
> mixing files together, as Dr. Mark is trying to do. What if the
> markers in the left channel and the right channel are not completely
> identical? I think this is a more complicated task than just copying
> input file markers to the output file when mixing.

Hi,

in that case I would propose to issue a warning and copy the markers
from one source - this can be achieved without understanding the markers.
A more elaborate solution could use both markers, but ommit markers
which are too close together. This, however requires extracting and
understanding the information of the markers.

regards,
Erich


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Re: merging mono files

[Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users]

On 2016-12-08 11:00, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
> I sent an email with a picture.... again it is being held for
> moderation..... :-(

Many mail lists don't accept any attachments of any sort to the mails.

The way a mail list works is whatever you send to the machine that runs 
the
list gets sent out to every subscriber - which on some lists will be 
tens of
thousands of people.  Subscribers generally don't want to see what are 
often
huge files (and might contain malware).

Instead, if you want us to see a picture, upload it to some picture 
hosting
website, and include that picture's URL in your mail.  Then anyone who 
wants
to look at it will go and fetch it, but the rest of us won't have to 
waste
bandwidth getting it even when we didn't want it.

Likewise, don't try to send audio files with your posts...

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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1001 bytes --]

A picture saves 100 words


On 08/12/2016 12:42, Peter P. wrote:
> * Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> [2016-12-08 12:02]:
>> I sent an email with a picture.... again it is being held for
>> moderation..... :-(
> Don't send picture attachments to email lists until you absolutely have
> to. Try to describe your problem in words which are then also readable
> by visually impaired.
>
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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1601 bytes --]

They are *identical *and most probably created when the samples were 
still in stereo format as the original recordings were made. The 
separation must have been done after to accommodate for Hauptwerk 
software's special features. The person who processed them like this 
died a year ago. I am now picking up the pieces and re-assembling them 
for a different software.


On 08/12/2016 12:45, Peter P. wrote:
> * Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> [2016-12-08 12:00]:
>> If Sox does not preserve loops and cues yet.... then please add that to the
>> wish list. It would be very handy for several people doing serious digital
>> sound processing. :-)
> I was thinking about the problem of markers in the file headers when
> mixing files together, as Dr. Mark is trying to do. What if the
> markers in the left channel and the right channel are not completely
> identical? I think this is a more complicated task than just copying
> input file markers to the output file when mixing.
>
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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1155 bytes --]

jOrgan forum/ mailing list on sourceforge works so well:

http://jorgan.999862.n4.nabble.com/jOrgan-User-f999863.html

Regards

Mark


On 08/12/2016 13:28, Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users wrote:
> On 2016-12-08 11:00, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
>> I sent an email with a picture.... again it is being held for
>> moderation..... :-(
> Many mail lists don't accept any attachments of any sort to the mails.
>
> The way a mail list works is whatever you send to the machine that runs
> the
> list gets sent out to every subscriber - which on some lists will be
> tens of
> thousands of people.  Subscribers generally don't want to see what are
> often
> huge files (and might contain malware).
>
> Instead, if you want us to see a picture, upload it to some picture
> hosting
> website, and include that picture's URL in your mail.  Then anyone who
> wants
> to look at it will go and fetch it, but the rest of us won't have to
> waste
> bandwidth getting it even when we didn't want it.
>
> Likewise, don't try to send audio files with your posts...
>



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Re: merging mono files

[Doug Lee]

On Thu, Dec 08, 2016 at 02:16:44PM +0100, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
>    A picture saves 100 words

   Unless the recipient is blind.

   I am.

   Sorry though, I am a seasoned SoX user but have not managed to follow this particular discussion carefully.

   On 08/12/2016 12:42, Peter P. wrote:

* Dr. Mark Bugeja MD [1]<marcusfb@gmail.com> [2016-12-08 12:02]:

I sent an email with a picture.... again it is being held for
moderation..... :-(

Don't send picture attachments to email lists until you absolutely have
to. Try to describe your problem in words which are then also readable
by visually impaired.

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References

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Re: merging mono files

[fmiser]

> > > Dr. Mark Bugeja wrote:
> > >
> > > If Sox does not preserve loops and cues yet.... then please
> > > add that to the wish list. It would be very handy for several
> > > people doing serious digital sound processing. :-)

Keep in mind, SoX is used by a lot of us for a lot of
different tasks.  The one task you are wanting to us it for
(joint two mono files into a stereo file) is a very tiny piece
of what SoX can do.
> >  Peter wrote:
> >
> > I was thinking about the problem of markers in the file
> > headers when mixing files together, as Dr. Mark is trying to
> > do. What if the markers in the left channel and the right
> > channel are not completely identical? I think this is a more
> > complicated task than just copying input file markers to the
> > output file when mixing.

> Dr. wrote:

> They are *identical*...

In _your_ case, they are identical.  But a SoX effect or
function can't be added just for _your_ case.  At least, not
if it doesn't behave well for other cases.

> ... and most probably created

So what should SoX do if it happens to be something other than
"most probably"?  SoX is good partly because it does work so
predictably even when doing odd or unusual things.
> The separation must have been done after to accommodate
> for Hauptwerk software's special features.

Again - in your case.  There is no guarantee, or even a high
probability,  that other people and other files would be the
same situation.

Something like "preserving loops and cues" has the potential for
being tricky for the reasons Peter wrote.  Then, as Jeremy pointed
out, they may be in a sidecar file and not in the audio file
itself.

Have you tested the stereo file you made using SoX?  Are the
markers intact?  If so, your situation is resolved.  If not -
maybe there is a way to copy the info from one of the mono
files to the stereo file.

But so far, I haven't seen from you what these "loops and
cues" are.  You described how you use them - but is it in the
header?  If so, where?  If not the header, then where is it?
Is it in a sidecar file like Jeremy described?


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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 3567 bytes --]

I cannot give any more information on where the loops and markers are. 
They are created using audio software.

It does not matter if SoX would not include features like these. I 
thought I'd make my perfectly legitimate request.... I tried.

I'll just have to be patient and do the job manually.

Thanks everyone for your interaction in trying to solve my difficulty. 
SoX was recommended to me by a friend with whom I create samplesets. I 
took up that recommendation but clearly this is not the software I need,

Apologies for any inconvenience caused. At least I got as far as merging 
two files using a bat process. Re-creating loops and markers and 
checking each is as much of a task as the process at hand so might as 
well just get on with it.

Best wishes to all,

Mark


On 08/12/2016 20:58, fmiser wrote:
>>>> Dr. Mark Bugeja wrote:
>>>>
>>>> If Sox does not preserve loops and cues yet.... then please
>>>> add that to the wish list. It would be very handy for several
>>>> people doing serious digital sound processing. :-)
> Keep in mind, SoX is used by a lot of us for a lot of
> different tasks.  The one task you are wanting to us it for
> (joint two mono files into a stereo file) is a very tiny piece
> of what SoX can do.
>>>   Peter wrote:
>>>
>>> I was thinking about the problem of markers in the file
>>> headers when mixing files together, as Dr. Mark is trying to
>>> do. What if the markers in the left channel and the right
>>> channel are not completely identical? I think this is a more
>>> complicated task than just copying input file markers to the
>>> output file when mixing.
>> Dr. wrote:
>> They are *identical*...
> In _your_ case, they are identical.  But a SoX effect or
> function can't be added just for _your_ case.  At least, not
> if it doesn't behave well for other cases.
>
>> ... and most probably created
> So what should SoX do if it happens to be something other than
> "most probably"?  SoX is good partly because it does work so
> predictably even when doing odd or unusual things.
>> The separation must have been done after to accommodate
>> for Hauptwerk software's special features.
> Again - in your case.  There is no guarantee, or even a high
> probability,  that other people and other files would be the
> same situation.
>
> Something like "preserving loops and cues" has the potential for
> being tricky for the reasons Peter wrote.  Then, as Jeremy pointed
> out, they may be in a sidecar file and not in the audio file
> itself.
>
> Have you tested the stereo file you made using SoX?  Are the
> markers intact?  If so, your situation is resolved.  If not -
> maybe there is a way to copy the info from one of the mono
> files to the stereo file.
>
> But so far, I haven't seen from you what these "loops and
> cues" are.  You described how you use them - but is it in the
> header?  If so, where?  If not the header, then where is it?
> Is it in a sidecar file like Jeremy described?
>
>
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Re: merging mono files

[Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users]

On 2016-12-08 20:37, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
> I cannot give any more information on where the loops and markers are.
> They are created using audio software.

Well, what software?


> Apologies for any inconvenience caused.

I'm sure no-one thinks you've caused any inconvenience.  We're all here
because we want to process audio files, and like the approach that sox
offers.

In my case, I use sox for things because it's easy to keep notes 
describing
what sox command I used to do something or other, whereas documenting 
how I
may have used a GUI-based application is far more difficult.  And, I 
worked
as a computer programmer so have little difficulty using sox (& other 
tools)
to find things out about portions of a set of audio files, and then use 
my
own programs to generate sox commands to manipulate those files.


> At least I got as far as
> merging two files using a bat process. Re-creating loops and markers
> and checking each is as much of a task as the process at hand so might
> as well just get on with it.

Does the audio tool within which you created these markers offer any 
options
for exporting marker definitions separate from audio data?


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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 4256 bytes --]

I have already alluded to the audio software I use, in previous posts. 
However there is one other I have not mentioned.

I create markers using /*iZotope RX3 Advanced*/. It allows me also to 
clean up samples from noise, cut pieces out, and do all sort of editing, 
like eliminating artefacts, change frequency of a good sample to say 
create missing/ unplayable or discordant notes when sampling a real 
instrument like an old pipe organ.

Loops are then generated. I use /*L*//*oop*//*A*//*uditioneer*/ 
(https://sourceforge.net/projects/loopauditioneer/) created by Lars 
Palo, a small but marvellous piece of software. It also sports other 
features eg generating pitch information to wav files vital when 
selecting to play the virtual instrument set to a different temperament 
to that which it was created from.

Some software if used may not show the loops/ markers and if I recall 
may even ignore and delete them upon saving any changes. I think, but I 
may be wrong, Audacity would do that but /*Sony Soundforge*/ doesn't. I 
stand to be corrected. I don't use Audacity that much.

Just for those who are interested, I have a website about my project in 
creating digital samplesets of instruments from recorded samples of real 
instruments:

  * http://maltesepipeorgans.webs.com

One may listen to these virtual instruments, as they are played by 
remote musicians in their homes, in my other website:

  * http://maltesepipeorgans2.webs.com

I cannot add more than this since I am in no way technically minded to 
be able to answer certain questions. I am capable of using some pieces 
of software in so far as what I have been taught to do by others in the 
know and, like a monkey, I just copy the steps I was shown to accomplish 
specific, routine and repetitive tasks in the process of creating 
digital wav files. Some processes are carried out by others eg noise 
reduction which can prove quite challenging at times considering that 
recording are made in churches where chairs are dragged across, doors 
banged, people talk in the background, cars, buses, trucks and motor 
bikes zooming past and hooting their horn in the busy streets outside, 
church bells ringing half way through a session, birds chirping, etc etc 
etc. Most frustrating. But the end results of hundreds or even thousands 
of hours of hard work are the clear and crisp wav files that can do 
justice to the instrument being replicated digitally.

The task I am now performing is basically reversing part of the process 
that was done to these files after loops and markers were created.... 
that of recombining the L and R channels back into single stereo samples 
preserving the processing done before the separation. Loops and markers 
are created in positions that apply to both channels in a stereo file so 
they are bound to match exactly when recombining them again.

Mark

On 08/12/2016 23:23, Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users wrote:
> On 2016-12-08 20:37, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
>> I cannot give any more information on where the loops and markers are.
>> They are created using audio software.
> Well, what software?
>
>
>> Apologies for any inconvenience caused.
> I'm sure no-one thinks you've caused any inconvenience.  We're all here
> because we want to process audio files, and like the approach that sox
> offers.
>
> In my case, I use sox for things because it's easy to keep notes
> describing
> what sox command I used to do something or other, whereas documenting
> how I
> may have used a GUI-based application is far more difficult.  And, I
> worked
> as a computer programmer so have little difficulty using sox (& other
> tools)
> to find things out about portions of a set of audio files, and then use
> my
> own programs to generate sox commands to manipulate those files.
>
>
>> At least I got as far as
>> merging two files using a bat process. Re-creating loops and markers
>> and checking each is as much of a task as the process at hand so might
>> as well just get on with it.
> Does the audio tool within which you created these markers offer any
> options
> for exporting marker definitions separate from audio data?
>
>



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Re: merging mono files

[Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users]

On 2016-12-08 23:23, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
> I have already alluded to the audio software I use, in previous posts.
> However there is one other I have not mentioned....

Thanks for that; I've had a quick look at some of the documentation for 
these.
I've also looked for tools that might help; this seems (to me) to be 
promising:

  http://tonbandstimmen.de/cuelisttool/index_e.htm

It appears to support export of cuelist data (which might include your 
loop
& marker info) from WAV files, and also support adding such data back 
into
WAV files.

Have you tried it?

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Re: merging mono files

[fmiser]

> Dr. wrote:

> I cannot give any more information on where the loops and
> markers are. They are created using audio software.

> I cannot add more than this since I am in no way technically
> minded to be able to answer certain questions.

Okay.

You are embarked on a task that appears to me to involve a
lot of technically minded tasks.  I asked because _I_ don't know -
and hoped you would.  And just because you don't know the details
doesn't mean SoX and this list can't help.
The list has proven again and again it is eager to help -
especially those who are willing to do some work for themselves.
I will admit, the list is also a bit rough on people who show up
and expect to be handed a solution with no effort of their own.

I'm not wanting to be rude, or harsh, but your early posts
seemed to suggest that you expected the list to tell you
exactly what you must type into the shell to make everything work
just right.  That will turn many people away from helping.

Said another way, we are here to _help_ you, not do it for you.
*smiles*  The more you help us understand, the more we can help
you.

> It does not matter if SoX would not include features like these.
> I thought I'd make my perfectly legitimate request.... I tried.

Did you check the one you merged to stereo?  Did the markers come
through or did they get lost?  Maybe it already does what you want!

In a former post, you wrote:

> and YES I get a stereo.wav which appears correct on Soundforge!!!
>
> Horrah!!

Does that mean the file that SoX merged DID retain the markers you
want?  Or is it just the audio and the markers are lost?

What you seem to be describing as loops and cues sure seems to NOT
be part of standard audio file specs.  It's impossible for me to
_do_ anything because I don't have any way to be sure any file I
have is what you are working with.  Maybe I can add a mark - but
is that the same as the one you have?

If SoX is NOT handling the markers, can you provide sample files?
There are some very clever people who might be able to figure
something out.  But if you can't describe it technically, and
can't indicate a standard it conforms to, or provide a sample, we
are probably unable to help you.

> I'll just have to be patient and do the job manually.

Do what you want.  *smiles*  There are a lot of us that are very
happy with what SoX can do for our audio task.  I'm willing to bet
every single one of us - probably including the developers - has
had to spend a chuck of time trying to figure out how to use this
supertool called SoX!  And if you are not comfortable with command
line, then you have two learning tasks on top of each other.

As to doing a tedious job manually, personally, I prefer spending
time figuring out how to use a batch processing tool - and build a
script to call it - than doing a repetitive task.  Then the job is
done AND I have added to my own "toolbox" so I'm better prepared
for the next challenge.  But that's just me.  You are free - and
welcome - to do as you please.
> SoX was recommended to me by a friend with whom I create
> samplesets. I took up that recommendation but clearly this is
> not the software I need,

SoX is very good at a LOT of audio processing tasks.  But it's
also not able to do everything.
Familiarity with using a command line and writing a batch file is
almost essential to what you are wanting to do.  Whether using SoX
or one of the tool I list below, success depends on BOTH what
command to run AND how to manipulate the command so it will
process a whole bunch.
You could also look at ecasound, though I think that may be a *nix
only program.  It too is a command line audio tool.  It
specializes in multitrack recording and editing, and your task of
merging two mono files into a stereo file is just the sort of
thing it does well.

ffmpeg is capable of combining two mono files into a stereo file.
I know it is available for MS Win.

I ran a search for "batch process stereo from two mono files" and found 
BatchPro.
http://www.digitalbrain-instruments.com/batchpro

I could not load the website, so I cannot comment further.

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Re: merging mono files

[René Bastian]

Hello happy soxers,

I use sox/play every day, in rehearsals & performances: it is a good
guy. So some users think: sox does so many things, why does it not
make what i need? Sox can be adapted; for my proper use, i wrote some
little pythons:

def joue(xnom):
    " joue le fichier "
    if xnom[-4:] == ".raw":
        comm = "play -c2 -e signed-integer -r44100 -b16 " + xnom
        os.system(comm)
    elif xnom[-4:] == ".wav":
        comm = "play " + xnom
        os.system(comm)

I dont like audiofiles with headers; i prefer couples of 2 files:
audiofilename.raw & audiofilename.info.

The raw files are strictly numeric (made with Python3 + Numpy); the
needed infos (SR, wordsize, markers [if any], etc) are in the
audiofilename.info.

Often headers are of fixed length (in wav files the header size is often
44 bytes long). In my sense, the best is to decode the header and then
to cut it. So one can handle the numeric file as you like it - given
that the OS permits it).

sox, i thank you

rb



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www.pythoneon.org

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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 7084 bytes --]

Thank you very much for your feedback. I must admit that this exercise 
was presented to me by a friend and I am myself trying to help him. To 
do so it seems like I have to learn a lot of things which would be 
beyond the routine tasks I do for myself. Generally I do not like 
automated processes in my project as it tends to increase artificiality 
rather than preserving the warts and all in the creation of digital 
replicas of real instruments. I do not want to achieve perfection to end 
up with perfect, dull, "synthesized" sounds that would be tiring to the 
ears. These just don't sound right and have been an issue with branded 
electronic instruments one can buy at music stores for as long as they 
have been in existence.

Though I am willing to learn new stuff, learning syntax and codes is not 
something I am prepared for at this point in time. I have already gone 
well out of my way to help someone else in my benevolence.... putting on 
the back burner my own stuff which I need to work on desperately. Whilst 
I did request the feature in a SoX update, I retract that completely as 
I realised that this situation was a one-off in the line of work I am 
doing and I doubt I'd ever come across a similar situation again. Most 
samplesets are processed in stereo and left as such. I recently learnt 
that it is only Hauptwerk software that apparently needs seperate 
channels to achieve a specific effect when tremolo is used.

What I hoped for was that someone had done this before and could tell me 
what lines of characters, dots, dashes and stars I needed to type to 
create a bat file that would do the job. It appears that many have not 
understood the task of creating digital samplesets, don not know what 
loops are etc. Fair enough. We're into different field in audio 
sampling. Granted. I am a doctor not a brain surgeon and I am not 
expected to handle brain tumours other than referring the patient to 
hospital if I suspect one.

My apologies if I sounded like I wanted a quick fix. I did want one, 
indeed. I don't think anyone would be prepared to learn Japanese to do a 
single translation for a friend or himself for that matter.

Regards

Mark


On 09/12/2016 10:08, fmiser wrote:
>> Dr. wrote:
>> I cannot give any more information on where the loops and
>> markers are. They are created using audio software.
>> I cannot add more than this since I am in no way technically
>> minded to be able to answer certain questions.
> Okay.
>
> You are embarked on a task that appears to me to involve a
> lot of technically minded tasks.  I asked because _I_ don't know -
> and hoped you would.  And just because you don't know the details
> doesn't mean SoX and this list can't help.
> The list has proven again and again it is eager to help -
> especially those who are willing to do some work for themselves.
> I will admit, the list is also a bit rough on people who show up
> and expect to be handed a solution with no effort of their own.
>
> I'm not wanting to be rude, or harsh, but your early posts
> seemed to suggest that you expected the list to tell you
> exactly what you must type into the shell to make everything work
> just right.  That will turn many people away from helping.
>
> Said another way, we are here to _help_ you, not do it for you.
> *smiles*  The more you help us understand, the more we can help
> you.
>
>> It does not matter if SoX would not include features like these.
>> I thought I'd make my perfectly legitimate request.... I tried.
> Did you check the one you merged to stereo?  Did the markers come
> through or did they get lost?  Maybe it already does what you want!
>
> In a former post, you wrote:
>
>> and YES I get a stereo.wav which appears correct on Soundforge!!!
>>
>> Horrah!!
> Does that mean the file that SoX merged DID retain the markers you
> want?  Or is it just the audio and the markers are lost?
>
> What you seem to be describing as loops and cues sure seems to NOT
> be part of standard audio file specs.  It's impossible for me to
> _do_ anything because I don't have any way to be sure any file I
> have is what you are working with.  Maybe I can add a mark - but
> is that the same as the one you have?
>
> If SoX is NOT handling the markers, can you provide sample files?
> There are some very clever people who might be able to figure
> something out.  But if you can't describe it technically, and
> can't indicate a standard it conforms to, or provide a sample, we
> are probably unable to help you.
>
>> I'll just have to be patient and do the job manually.
> Do what you want.  *smiles*  There are a lot of us that are very
> happy with what SoX can do for our audio task.  I'm willing to bet
> every single one of us - probably including the developers - has
> had to spend a chuck of time trying to figure out how to use this
> supertool called SoX!  And if you are not comfortable with command
> line, then you have two learning tasks on top of each other.
>
> As to doing a tedious job manually, personally, I prefer spending
> time figuring out how to use a batch processing tool - and build a
> script to call it - than doing a repetitive task.  Then the job is
> done AND I have added to my own "toolbox" so I'm better prepared
> for the next challenge.  But that's just me.  You are free - and
> welcome - to do as you please.
>> SoX was recommended to me by a friend with whom I create
>> samplesets. I took up that recommendation but clearly this is
>> not the software I need,
> SoX is very good at a LOT of audio processing tasks.  But it's
> also not able to do everything.
> Familiarity with using a command line and writing a batch file is
> almost essential to what you are wanting to do.  Whether using SoX
> or one of the tool I list below, success depends on BOTH what
> command to run AND how to manipulate the command so it will
> process a whole bunch.
> You could also look at ecasound, though I think that may be a *nix
> only program.  It too is a command line audio tool.  It
> specializes in multitrack recording and editing, and your task of
> merging two mono files into a stereo file is just the sort of
> thing it does well.
>
> ffmpeg is capable of combining two mono files into a stereo file.
> I know it is available for MS Win.
>
> I ran a search for "batch process stereo from two mono files" and found
> BatchPro.
> http://www.digitalbrain-instruments.com/batchpro
>
> I could not load the website, so I cannot comment further.
>
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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1069 bytes --]

I just did. It lists the cues as text. I copied that, opened the stereo 
sample created by sox and similar text appeared for that. Neither would 
show a wav profile with the stereo sox generated sample eliciting an 
error that it was not in a compatible format. There is no paste button 
either!

Mark


On 09/12/2016 06:43, Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users wrote:
> On 2016-12-08 23:23, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
>> I have already alluded to the audio software I use, in previous posts.
>> However there is one other I have not mentioned....
> Thanks for that; I've had a quick look at some of the documentation for
> these.
> I've also looked for tools that might help; this seems (to me) to be
> promising:
>
>    http://tonbandstimmen.de/cuelisttool/index_e.htm
>
> It appears to support export of cuelist data (which might include your
> loop
> & marker info) from WAV files, and also support adding such data back
> into
> WAV files.
>
> Have you tried it?
>



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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 5140 bytes --]

Furthermore, I am sure I have mentioned already in a previous message 
that the sox generated stereo sample did not show up and cues or loops. 
It merely merged the two mono files.

I'll look into BatchPro as my last chance on the matter.


On 09/12/2016 10:08, fmiser wrote:
>> Dr. wrote:
>> I cannot give any more information on where the loops and
>> markers are. They are created using audio software.
>> I cannot add more than this since I am in no way technically
>> minded to be able to answer certain questions.
> Okay.
>
> You are embarked on a task that appears to me to involve a
> lot of technically minded tasks.  I asked because _I_ don't know -
> and hoped you would.  And just because you don't know the details
> doesn't mean SoX and this list can't help.
> The list has proven again and again it is eager to help -
> especially those who are willing to do some work for themselves.
> I will admit, the list is also a bit rough on people who show up
> and expect to be handed a solution with no effort of their own.
>
> I'm not wanting to be rude, or harsh, but your early posts
> seemed to suggest that you expected the list to tell you
> exactly what you must type into the shell to make everything work
> just right.  That will turn many people away from helping.
>
> Said another way, we are here to _help_ you, not do it for you.
> *smiles*  The more you help us understand, the more we can help
> you.
>
>> It does not matter if SoX would not include features like these.
>> I thought I'd make my perfectly legitimate request.... I tried.
> Did you check the one you merged to stereo?  Did the markers come
> through or did they get lost?  Maybe it already does what you want!
>
> In a former post, you wrote:
>
>> and YES I get a stereo.wav which appears correct on Soundforge!!!
>>
>> Horrah!!
> Does that mean the file that SoX merged DID retain the markers you
> want?  Or is it just the audio and the markers are lost?
>
> What you seem to be describing as loops and cues sure seems to NOT
> be part of standard audio file specs.  It's impossible for me to
> _do_ anything because I don't have any way to be sure any file I
> have is what you are working with.  Maybe I can add a mark - but
> is that the same as the one you have?
>
> If SoX is NOT handling the markers, can you provide sample files?
> There are some very clever people who might be able to figure
> something out.  But if you can't describe it technically, and
> can't indicate a standard it conforms to, or provide a sample, we
> are probably unable to help you.
>
>> I'll just have to be patient and do the job manually.
> Do what you want.  *smiles*  There are a lot of us that are very
> happy with what SoX can do for our audio task.  I'm willing to bet
> every single one of us - probably including the developers - has
> had to spend a chuck of time trying to figure out how to use this
> supertool called SoX!  And if you are not comfortable with command
> line, then you have two learning tasks on top of each other.
>
> As to doing a tedious job manually, personally, I prefer spending
> time figuring out how to use a batch processing tool - and build a
> script to call it - than doing a repetitive task.  Then the job is
> done AND I have added to my own "toolbox" so I'm better prepared
> for the next challenge.  But that's just me.  You are free - and
> welcome - to do as you please.
>> SoX was recommended to me by a friend with whom I create
>> samplesets. I took up that recommendation but clearly this is
>> not the software I need,
> SoX is very good at a LOT of audio processing tasks.  But it's
> also not able to do everything.
> Familiarity with using a command line and writing a batch file is
> almost essential to what you are wanting to do.  Whether using SoX
> or one of the tool I list below, success depends on BOTH what
> command to run AND how to manipulate the command so it will
> process a whole bunch.
> You could also look at ecasound, though I think that may be a *nix
> only program.  It too is a command line audio tool.  It
> specializes in multitrack recording and editing, and your task of
> merging two mono files into a stereo file is just the sort of
> thing it does well.
>
> ffmpeg is capable of combining two mono files into a stereo file.
> I know it is available for MS Win.
>
> I ran a search for "batch process stereo from two mono files" and found
> BatchPro.
> http://www.digitalbrain-instruments.com/batchpro
>
> I could not load the website, so I cannot comment further.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2484 bytes --]

Apologies. Many of us tend to take a lot of things forgranted.

Mark


On 08/12/2016 14:47, Doug Lee wrote:
> On Thu, Dec 08, 2016 at 02:16:44PM +0100, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
>>     A picture saves 100 words
>     Unless the recipient is blind.
>
>     I am.
>
>     Sorry though, I am a seasoned SoX user but have not managed to follow this particular discussion carefully.
>
>     On 08/12/2016 12:42, Peter P. wrote:
>
> * Dr. Mark Bugeja MD [1]<marcusfb@gmail.com> [2016-12-08 12:02]:
>
> I sent an email with a picture.... again it is being held for
> moderation..... :-(
>
> Don't send picture attachments to email lists until you absolutely have
> to. Try to describe your problem in words which are then also readable
> by visually impaired.
>
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> References
>
>     1. mailto:marcusfb@gmail.com
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>     3. https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/sox-users
>     4. https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient
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Re: merging mono files

[Jan Stary]

On Dec 08 12:45:14, peterparker@fastmail.com wrote:
> * Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> [2016-12-08 12:00]:
> > If Sox does not preserve loops and cues yet.... then please add that to the
> > wish list. It would be very handy for several people doing serious digital
> > sound processing. :-)
> I was thinking about the problem of markers in the file headers when
> mixing files together, as Dr. Mark is trying to do. What if the
> markers in the left channel and the right channel are not completely
> identical? I think this is a more complicated task than just copying
> input file markers to the output file when mixing.

I believe the markers are just points in time, i.e. they exist for
the stream as a whole, not for individual channels. At least
I have not seen those yet.



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Re: merging mono files

[Jan Stary]

On Dec 08 21:37:02, marcusfb@gmail.com wrote:
> I cannot give any more information on where the loops and markers are. They
> are created using audio software.

Of course they are. How does that mean you cannot give
any more information? Create the stereo file as advised
and look at the result with an "audio software" which
recognizes merkers and loops and cues and whatnot.

Are they there? That is, did SoX preserve them?
I just tested, and it seems SoX does _not_ preserve them.

BTW, here is a teeny tiny "audio software" which can display
the markers and cues, and three files to test it on.

http://stare.cz/utils/libwav.tar
http://stare.cz/.tmp/microtrack.wav
http://stare.cz/.tmp/zoom-H1.wav
http://stare.cz/.tmp/zoom-H2.wav

> It does not matter if SoX would not include features like these. I thought
> I'd make my perfectly legitimate request.... I tried.

I'll repeat: what kind of recordings is it that you are processing?
So far, it seems they are trumpet note samples? Does it use markers?
If they are small enough, can you show us two of them (left and right)?

> I'll just have to be patient and do the job manually.

No, why would you?

> Thanks everyone for your interaction in trying to solve my difficulty. SoX
> was recommended to me by a friend with whom I create samplesets. I took up
> that recommendation but clearly this is not the software I need,

Well, it seems SoX would not preserver the markers for you.
I might add markers copying to the tool above.

	Jan


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Re: merging mono files

[Jan Stary]

On Dec 09 00:23:21, marcusfb@gmail.com wrote:
> The task I am now performing is basically reversing part of the process that
> was done to these files after loops and markers were created.... that of
> recombining the L and R channels back into single stereo samples preserving
> the processing done before the separation. Loops and markers are created in
> positions that apply to both channels in a stereo file so they are bound to
> match exactly when recombining them again.

One more question: if these are samples of real instruments,
how much do you need them to be stereo? For e.g. a trumpet,
can you just take the "left trumpet sample" an pronounce it
the stereo trumpet", just duplicating the channel? Or is there
an actual difference? (There will be for pipe organs of course).

But that's probably the same problem when done with SoX:
you would lose the markers.

	Jan


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Re: merging mono files

[Jan Stary]

On Dec 09 03:08:29, fmiser@gmail.com wrote:
> What you seem to be describing as loops and cues sure seems to NOT
> be part of standard audio file specs.

It is standardized a bit:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadcast_Wave_Format

The files I sent earlier are BWF files, which means WAV
with some extensions in the header - such as markers.


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Re: merging mono files

[Jan Stary]

On Dec 09 13:33:15, marcusfb@gmail.com wrote:
> Thank you very much for your feedback. I must admit that this exercise was
> presented to me by a friend and I am myself trying to help him. To do so it
> seems like I have to learn a lot of things which would be beyond the routine
> tasks I do for myself. Generally I do not like automated processes in my
> project as it tends to increase artificiality rather than preserving the
> warts and all in the creation of digital replicas of real instruments. I do
> not want to achieve perfection to end up with perfect, dull, "synthesized"
> sounds that would be tiring to the ears. These just don't sound right and
> have been an issue with branded electronic instruments one can buy at music
> stores for as long as they have been in existence.

Joining the left and right channel of a trumpet,
an automated process if there is one, surely does not
"increase artificiality", and is precisely a thing
that should be done automatically.

> Most samplesets are
> processed in stereo and left as such. I recently learnt that it is only
> Hauptwerk software that apparently needs seperate channels to achieve a
> specific effect when tremolo is used.

Eh, throw it away then.


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Re: merging mono files

[Jan Stary]

On Dec 09 14:02:38, hans@stare.cz wrote:
> On Dec 08 12:45:14, peterparker@fastmail.com wrote:
> > * Dr. Mark Bugeja MD <marcusfb@gmail.com> [2016-12-08 12:00]:
> > > If Sox does not preserve loops and cues yet.... then please add that to the
> > > wish list. It would be very handy for several people doing serious digital
> > > sound processing. :-)
> > I was thinking about the problem of markers in the file headers when
> > mixing files together, as Dr. Mark is trying to do. What if the
> > markers in the left channel and the right channel are not completely
> > identical? I think this is a more complicated task than just copying
> > input file markers to the output file when mixing.
> 
> I believe the markers are just points in time, i.e. they exist for
> the stream as a whole, not for individual channels. At least
> I have not seen those yet.

(Unless the two channels are separate files of course)


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Re: merging mono files

[Jan Stary]

On Dec 08 14:16:44, marcusfb@gmail.com wrote:
> A picture saves 100 words

A picture wastes 100 kilobytes.


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Re: merging mono files

[Jan Stary]

On Dec 08 12:28:48, jn.ml.sxu.88@wingsandbeaks.org.uk wrote:
> Instead, if you want us to see a picture, upload it to some picture 
> hosting
> website, and include that picture's URL in your mail.
> wants
> to look at it will go and fetch it, but the rest of us won't have to 
> waste
> bandwidth getting it even when we didn't want it.
> 
> Likewise, don't try to send audio files with your posts...

But _do_ post them somewhere and give us a link.


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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2414 bytes --]

Sorry.... I meant what not where.

Sox did NOT preserve the markers.

I have sent a link to a picture before.

Here it is again: 
https://mega.nz/#!dQIwkDKI!QlrmlYHywFqpG9ujJfJLBm_1skxaYz88AJJJy4Euxs0

Regards

Mark


On 09/12/2016 14:17, Jan Stary wrote:
> On Dec 08 21:37:02, marcusfb@gmail.com wrote:
>> I cannot give any more information on where the loops and markers are. They
>> are created using audio software.
> Of course they are. How does that mean you cannot give
> any more information? Create the stereo file as advised
> and look at the result with an "audio software" which
> recognizes merkers and loops and cues and whatnot.
>
> Are they there? That is, did SoX preserve them?
> I just tested, and it seems SoX does _not_ preserve them.
>
> BTW, here is a teeny tiny "audio software" which can display
> the markers and cues, and three files to test it on.
>
> http://stare.cz/utils/libwav.tar
> http://stare.cz/.tmp/microtrack.wav
> http://stare.cz/.tmp/zoom-H1.wav
> http://stare.cz/.tmp/zoom-H2.wav
>
>> It does not matter if SoX would not include features like these. I thought
>> I'd make my perfectly legitimate request.... I tried.
> I'll repeat: what kind of recordings is it that you are processing?
> So far, it seems they are trumpet note samples? Does it use markers?
> If they are small enough, can you show us two of them (left and right)?
>
>> I'll just have to be patient and do the job manually.
> No, why would you?
>
>> Thanks everyone for your interaction in trying to solve my difficulty. SoX
>> was recommended to me by a friend with whom I create samplesets. I took up
>> that recommendation but clearly this is not the software I need,
> Well, it seems SoX would not preserver the markers for you.
> I might add markers copying to the tool above.
>
> 	Jan
>
>
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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

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I stated trumpet to give an example. I am processing pipe organs. Pipe 
organs have different stops representing different sounds some emulating 
and therefore named after the instruments they represent. Each stop 
activates that sound for a rage of keys, usually around 61 keys. Each 
key pressed will open an airflow vent that channels wind into a pipe and 
sound is produced. Successive keys will generate sound from one 
(sometimes as many as 20+ pipes) of an array of pipes positioned across 
from left to right so one note sounds from a pipe to the left and the 
next, a pipe on the right, the next from the left and so on. Since these 
pipes in real life are next to each other and occupy a fairly wide space 
the stereo recording are used to give that sensation of the pipes' 
spacial distribution when played digitally. So it's not a matter of a 
simple left and right.

Loops are needed to perpetuate the sound for the duration of time a key 
is pressed even though a recorded sample may be of just 6 seconds' 
duration. The software loops the sound until the key is release. I have 
mentioned this before.

This video may give a bit more insight in what is to be achieved: 
https://youtu.be/dsoWg38TjpU

Mark


On 09/12/2016 14:21, Jan Stary wrote:
> On Dec 09 00:23:21, marcusfb@gmail.com wrote:
>> The task I am now performing is basically reversing part of the process that
>> was done to these files after loops and markers were created.... that of
>> recombining the L and R channels back into single stereo samples preserving
>> the processing done before the separation. Loops and markers are created in
>> positions that apply to both channels in a stereo file so they are bound to
>> match exactly when recombining them again.
> One more question: if these are samples of real instruments,
> how much do you need them to be stereo? For e.g. a trumpet,
> can you just take the "left trumpet sample" an pronounce it
> the stereo trumpet", just duplicating the channel? Or is there
> an actual difference? (There will be for pipe organs of course).
>
> But that's probably the same problem when done with SoX:
> you would lose the markers.
>
> 	Jan
>
>
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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

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Try tell that to professional organist. You won't be getting any 
standing ovation!

Hauptwerk is considered the best, most professional software for playing 
digital organs, pianos, harpsichords etc. and it does not come cheap 
either, as do most of the samplesets for this software!


On 09/12/2016 14:36, Jan Stary wrote:
> On Dec 09 13:33:15, marcusfb@gmail.com wrote:
>> Thank you very much for your feedback. I must admit that this exercise was
>> presented to me by a friend and I am myself trying to help him. To do so it
>> seems like I have to learn a lot of things which would be beyond the routine
>> tasks I do for myself. Generally I do not like automated processes in my
>> project as it tends to increase artificiality rather than preserving the
>> warts and all in the creation of digital replicas of real instruments. I do
>> not want to achieve perfection to end up with perfect, dull, "synthesized"
>> sounds that would be tiring to the ears. These just don't sound right and
>> have been an issue with branded electronic instruments one can buy at music
>> stores for as long as they have been in existence.
> Joining the left and right channel of a trumpet,
> an automated process if there is one, surely does not
> "increase artificiality", and is precisely a thing
> that should be done automatically.
>
>> Most samplesets are
>> processed in stereo and left as such. I recently learnt that it is only
>> Hauptwerk software that apparently needs seperate channels to achieve a
>> specific effect when tremolo is used.
> Eh, throw it away then.
>
>
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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

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indeed. But they do drive home in an instant a point far better than a 
lengthy description.


On 09/12/2016 14:39, Jan Stary wrote:
> On Dec 08 14:16:44, marcusfb@gmail.com wrote:
>> A picture saves 100 words
> A picture wastes 100 kilobytes.
>
>
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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

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I have twice... but some messages are not being seen or read through, I 
guess. :-(


On 09/12/2016 14:40, Jan Stary wrote:
> On Dec 08 12:28:48, jn.ml.sxu.88@wingsandbeaks.org.uk wrote:
>> Instead, if you want us to see a picture, upload it to some picture
>> hosting
>> website, and include that picture's URL in your mail.
>> wants
>> to look at it will go and fetch it, but the rest of us won't have to
>> waste
>> bandwidth getting it even when we didn't want it.
>>
>> Likewise, don't try to send audio files with your posts...
> But _do_ post them somewhere and give us a link.
>
>
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Re: merging mono files

[Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users]

On 2016-12-09 12:37, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
> I just did. It lists the cues as text. I copied that, opened the
> stereo sample created by sox and similar text appeared for that.

So you're saying that the cue info in the mono files DID arrive in the
merged file that sox created?


> Neither would show a wav profile

None of the screenshots on that program's website show a 'wav profile'
(if you mean the waveform?) so why would you expect to see one?

> with the stereo sox generated sample eliciting an error that it was not
> in a compatible format.

But you said at the top that the program did manage to extract cue 
information.

Was the cue info from the merged file exactly as you expected it to be?


> There is no paste button either!

I've never used the app.  Its website says quite clearly that it can 
import
cue info to a wave file.  Looking at the screenshots, there's a whole 
load of
buttons at the righthand side of the main window.  Do none of those do 
what you
want?


x
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Re: merging mono files

[Dr. Mark Bugeja MD]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1474 bytes --]

No - the cue information was in the original mono file.

There is a button called wav.... :-/

I tried copying the info from the original file and paste into the 
merged stereo one. I couldn't.

I do not have time at present to learn what this program does and how.

Mark


On 09/12/2016 20:46, Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users wrote:
> On 2016-12-09 12:37, Dr. Mark Bugeja MD wrote:
>> I just did. It lists the cues as text. I copied that, opened the
>> stereo sample created by sox and similar text appeared for that.
> So you're saying that the cue info in the mono files DID arrive in the
> merged file that sox created?
>
>
>> Neither would show a wav profile
> None of the screenshots on that program's website show a 'wav profile'
> (if you mean the waveform?) so why would you expect to see one?
>
>> with the stereo sox generated sample eliciting an error that it was not
>> in a compatible format.
> But you said at the top that the program did manage to extract cue
> information.
>
> Was the cue info from the merged file exactly as you expected it to be?
>
>
>> There is no paste button either!
> I've never used the app.  Its website says quite clearly that it can
> import
> cue info to a wave file.  Looking at the screenshots, there's a whole
> load of
> buttons at the righthand side of the main window.  Do none of those do
> what you
> want?
>
>
> x



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Re: merging mono files

[Jan Stary]

On Dec 09 14:44:38, marcusfb@gmail.com wrote:
> Sorry.... I meant what not where.
> 
> Sox did NOT preserve the markers.
> 
> I have sent a link to a picture before.
> 
> Here it is again:
> https://mega.nz/#!dQIwkDKI!QlrmlYHywFqpG9ujJfJLBm_1skxaYz88AJJJy4Euxs0

Here's the error message again:

	An error occurred while loading MEGA.

	Filename: :0
	Exception: out of memory

	Please try again later. We apologize for the inconvenience.


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Re: merging mono files

[Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users]

On 2016-12-08 10:46, Jeremy Nicoll - ml sox users wrote:

> I've a Tascam HD-P2 which records on to a CF card.  If you look at that
> from a computer, each project is a series of Take<nn>.wav files, plus 
> two
> others:
> settings.xml & markers.xml.

I don't normally use the marker facility on this machine, but I've just 
made a
small experimental recording and placed three markers in it.  Here is 
what the
markers.xml file then contained:

<?xml version="1.0"?>
<ProjectMarkers>
<Marker>
<Name>Mark00</Name>
<Location>
<Low>791552l</Low>
<High>0l</High>
</Location>
</Marker>
<Marker>
<Name>Mark01</Name>
<Location>
<Low>1192960l</Low>
<High>0l</High>
</Location>
</Marker>
<Marker>
<Name>Mark02</Name>
<Location>
<Low>1490944l</Low>
<High>0l</High>
</Location>
</Marker>
</ProjectMarkers>

As well as these user-set markers, it's possible to have the machine 
insert
markers of its own, when there's "overs", or time-code dropouts.


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