From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on dcvr.yhbt.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.6 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN,FREEMAIL_FROM, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,SPF_HELO_PASS, SPF_PASS shortcircuit=no autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by dcvr.yhbt.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7632F1F5AE for ; Sun, 14 Jun 2020 08:48:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1726574AbgFNIsg (ORCPT ); Sun, 14 Jun 2020 04:48:36 -0400 Received: from lindbergh.monkeyblade.net ([23.128.96.19]:47682 "EHLO lindbergh.monkeyblade.net" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1725267AbgFNIsf (ORCPT ); Sun, 14 Jun 2020 04:48:35 -0400 Received: from mail-lj1-x235.google.com (mail-lj1-x235.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::235]) by lindbergh.monkeyblade.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2959BC03E969 for ; Sun, 14 Jun 2020 01:48:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lj1-x235.google.com with SMTP id i3so11088449ljg.3 for ; Sun, 14 Jun 2020 01:48:34 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=s/CkoqaLUof4Qul4/LOL6sb7geQZ7pFIHthEA6/2llw=; b=IhlRofl6YTqEbIAbUN6L6gs3RMGR2ARIE55oojfKi7zMxjYNDjyhf1qQEPtLbRZMAI H1ysZPayxU2yZeODnW21InMNniEKdxZGX8aVt4ywraVKlIdp2VF3Kf+yaGFq+wRMGyRd kNfYCoMgVe7IaLC5fRkQfNY3rFaxGnhcukfJu3BdF/YwXYYNem5LdF0qeIi79CvtIsIm vwyfRfh9Fz1WPHTPeUb/FQCRaB1quT7L54zg10e5XuntviRweQF3ZoyCGOMNfEIvGtdI kGM7dHCJx2fk+/NsPm3v6mIJaAH5/IMwLCickiuZf6FOEXSD3Du9vU1GEwCD1QxpX4+2 i8ww== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=s/CkoqaLUof4Qul4/LOL6sb7geQZ7pFIHthEA6/2llw=; b=rt0BlQfK7bV9GUEDCTsnPjKGaWdOoD7oEN/fxwFXnyrf5u8rmZ+eyXtdJ1AwAxgqfF 0KkX3CGmInzGQhhcp7xXDUp5yruFUEhtwhSmAWmXHha74dzTOAKxbU8k1PrF8UJ2l4e0 SsuUJSX1Mn6NneK5FwX8mDCLOQrsdecRajKKa8pHjPr2w0rqn4Ah+aoz6y+EERDgc11l iXNHpioegmuclerBwAfzlTX8swOI2pTE3uYml6kk63NwIzzxGCRDy20NnQuoB3bhLg5z wS4VY69Nxkbx/YyKUxZ12eExY8fVMUwPZ4ANAkqu/CKI7WtsGJ7pJd8CzY4ei3+jycnP hKjQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5315/42SrhzLRz/6z3z5DeJHHwhp6nXtUB44KYmeMx4aNgatyHqM GbGxcAwttzYw0ol8xfH1d0WC9OSsYd5WDBqr9O5YscKF4Yc= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxtM3pZm2m++WISfDUAg0QQRy/wiSRPjcPcrpnb/0kXyToFqK+z9qdpHaektD3ZseC0/ntk/KbRs4ZhKQ2PRrg= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:8903:: with SMTP id d3mr9668908lji.298.1592124512476; Sun, 14 Jun 2020 01:48:32 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <0dd6b6c2-4ea4-498d-4481-7f65988db293@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: From: Sergey Lapin Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2020 11:48:18 +0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Rename offensive terminology (master) To: Don Goodman-Wilson Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?S=C3=A9rgio_Augusto_Vianna?= , Junio C Hamano , git@vger.kernel.org, "brian m. carlson" , Simon Pieters Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: git-owner@vger.kernel.org Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: git@vger.kernel.org And I'm also offended by "main" On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 11:47 AM Sergey Lapin wrote: > > Americans' perpetual offendedness with everything is what leads to what w= as > written in Fahrenheit 451. Constant obsession with offendedness and const= ant > valuing of everyone else about "should I be offended now?" is so much > American now it became really concerning among all this PC culture. > Won't you stop your great self-destruction guys? > > On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 9:36 AM Don Goodman-Wilson > wrote: > > > > (Sorry, I meant "many (if not most) non-native English speakers DON'T > > realize just how explosive certain English locutions can be to > > American native speakers.") > > > > On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 8:32 AM Don Goodman-Wilson > > wrote: > > > > > > I am an American living in Europe. Let me offer an analogy. Like all > > > analogies, this one is imperfect, but I think it will serve to make m= y > > > point. > > > > > > As an American, I don't understand French humor. It's simply beyond > > > me. I've had it explained to me numerous times, but of course > > > explaining a joke can't impart its inherent humor. But none of this > > > should come as a surprise to anyone, as humor is a deeply cultural > > > artifact, something that can only truly be understood by those raised > > > within that culture. Even so, we can all appreciate the concept of > > > humor generally. More to the point, I certainly don't go around > > > denying that French humor exists, on the basis that I don't get it. > > > > > > In the same way, something I've learned living in Europe is that many > > > (if not most) non-native English speakers realize just how explosive > > > certain English locutions can be to American native speakers. That's > > > totally understanable as, like French humor, you have to have been > > > raised in the culture to really understand that fact. Like humor, we > > > all have a sense of what offensiveness means, and like humor, this > > > explosive content is a deeply cultural artifact, something that can > > > only truly be understood by those raised within that culture. The > > > visceral feeling of explosive content will probably always be beyond > > > grasping, just as French humor will probably never make me laugh. > > > > > > But to deny that explosive content on the basis that you don't > > > personally feel it, that you've never experienced it? To claim that i= t > > > is "meaningless", that some people are "perpetually offended"? That's > > > willful ignorance on your part, a bad-faith effort to engage in > > > serious intellectual conversation about what is good and right, and > > > has no place in a discussion about creating an inclusive space for al= l > > > developers, let alone trying to bring about a more just world. > > > > > > Don Goodman-Wilson > > > > > > On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 2:50 AM S=C3=A9rgio Augusto Vianna > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Then why create all this disruption by changing the default from ma= ster > > > > to "main" if you will offer a feature to set the default on creatio= n? > > > > Americans were discussing trump's tiny hands last week and will hav= e > > > > moved on to any other meaningless subject the next one. You can > > > > literally never please the perpetually offended. Taking this kind o= f > > > > slacktivism and creating problems for other people is a disgusting = level > > > > of entitlement that only americans display. You really care about > > > > others? Remember there's other countries in the world. > > > >