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* Git in Outreachy December 2019?
@ 2019-08-27  5:17 Jeff King
  2019-08-31  7:58 ` Christian Couder
                   ` (2 more replies)
  0 siblings, 3 replies; 14+ messages in thread
From: Jeff King @ 2019-08-27  5:17 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: git; +Cc: Olga Telezhnaya, Christian Couder, Elijah Newren, Thomas Gummerer

Do we have interested mentors for the next round of Outreachy?

The deadline for Git to apply to the program is September 5th. The
deadline for mentors to have submitted project descriptions is September
24th. Intern applications would start on October 1st.

If there are mentors who want to participate, I can handle the project
application and can start asking around for funding.

-Peff

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

* Re: Git in Outreachy December 2019?
  2019-08-27  5:17 Git in Outreachy December 2019? Jeff King
@ 2019-08-31  7:58 ` Christian Couder
  2019-08-31 19:44   ` Olga Telezhnaya
  2019-09-04 19:41 ` Jeff King
  2019-09-13 20:03 ` Jonathan Tan
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 14+ messages in thread
From: Christian Couder @ 2019-08-31  7:58 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Jeff King; +Cc: git, Olga Telezhnaya, Elijah Newren, Thomas Gummerer

On Tue, Aug 27, 2019 at 7:17 AM Jeff King <peff@peff.net> wrote:
>
> Do we have interested mentors for the next round of Outreachy?

I am interested to co-mentor.

> The deadline for Git to apply to the program is September 5th. The
> deadline for mentors to have submitted project descriptions is September
> 24th. Intern applications would start on October 1st.
>
> If there are mentors who want to participate, I can handle the project
> application and can start asking around for funding.

That would be really nice, thank you!

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

* Re: Git in Outreachy December 2019?
  2019-08-31  7:58 ` Christian Couder
@ 2019-08-31 19:44   ` Olga Telezhnaya
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 14+ messages in thread
From: Olga Telezhnaya @ 2019-08-31 19:44 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Christian Couder; +Cc: Jeff King, git, Elijah Newren, Thomas Gummerer

сб, 31 авг. 2019 г. в 10:58, Christian Couder <christian.couder@gmail.com>:
>
> On Tue, Aug 27, 2019 at 7:17 AM Jeff King <peff@peff.net> wrote:
> >
> > Do we have interested mentors for the next round of Outreachy?
>
> I am interested to co-mentor.

I am not ready to give the answer right now, but I will definitely
think about the project proposals, I want to help with that part. By
the way, we can take some projects (with description) from this summer
round of GSoC. 3 of 4 projects were not selected.

>
> > The deadline for Git to apply to the program is September 5th. The
> > deadline for mentors to have submitted project descriptions is September
> > 24th. Intern applications would start on October 1st.
> >
> > If there are mentors who want to participate, I can handle the project
> > application and can start asking around for funding.
>
> That would be really nice, thank you!

Thank you!

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

* Re: Git in Outreachy December 2019?
  2019-08-27  5:17 Git in Outreachy December 2019? Jeff King
  2019-08-31  7:58 ` Christian Couder
@ 2019-09-04 19:41 ` Jeff King
  2019-09-05  7:24   ` Christian Couder
                     ` (2 more replies)
  2019-09-13 20:03 ` Jonathan Tan
  2 siblings, 3 replies; 14+ messages in thread
From: Jeff King @ 2019-09-04 19:41 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: git
  Cc: Olga Telezhnaya, Christian Couder, Elijah Newren,
	Thomas Gummerer, Matheus Tavares Bernardino

On Tue, Aug 27, 2019 at 01:17:57AM -0400, Jeff King wrote:

> Do we have interested mentors for the next round of Outreachy?
> 
> The deadline for Git to apply to the program is September 5th. The
> deadline for mentors to have submitted project descriptions is September
> 24th. Intern applications would start on October 1st.
> 
> If there are mentors who want to participate, I can handle the project
> application and can start asking around for funding.

Funding is still up in the air, but in the meantime I've tentatively
signed us up (we have until the 24th to have the funding committed).
Next we need mentors to submit projects, as well as first-time
contribution micro-projects.

Project proposals can be made here:

  https://www.outreachy.org/communities/cfp/git/

If you want to know more about the program, there's a mentor FAQ here:

  https://www.outreachy.org/mentor/mentor-faq/

or just ask in this thread.

The project page has a section to point people in the right direction
for first-time contributions. I've left it blank for now, but I think it
makes sense to point one (or both) of:

  - https://git-scm.com/docs/MyFirstContribution

  - https://matheustavares.gitlab.io/posts/first-steps-contributing-to-git

as well as a list of micro-projects (or at least instructions on how to
find #leftoverbits, though we'd definitely have to step up our labeling,
as I do not recall having seen one for a while).

-Peff

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

* Re: Git in Outreachy December 2019?
  2019-09-04 19:41 ` Jeff King
@ 2019-09-05  7:24   ` Christian Couder
  2019-09-05 19:39   ` Emily Shaffer
  2019-09-08 14:56   ` Pratyush Yadav
  2 siblings, 0 replies; 14+ messages in thread
From: Christian Couder @ 2019-09-05  7:24 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Jeff King
  Cc: git, Olga Telezhnaya, Elijah Newren, Thomas Gummerer,
	Matheus Tavares Bernardino

On Wed, Sep 4, 2019 at 9:41 PM Jeff King <peff@peff.net> wrote:
>
> Funding is still up in the air, but in the meantime I've tentatively
> signed us up (we have until the 24th to have the funding committed).
> Next we need mentors to submit projects, as well as first-time
> contribution micro-projects.

Great! Thanks for signing up and for all the information!

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

* Re: Git in Outreachy December 2019?
  2019-09-04 19:41 ` Jeff King
  2019-09-05  7:24   ` Christian Couder
@ 2019-09-05 19:39   ` Emily Shaffer
  2019-09-06 11:55     ` Carlo Arenas
  2019-09-07  6:36     ` Jeff King
  2019-09-08 14:56   ` Pratyush Yadav
  2 siblings, 2 replies; 14+ messages in thread
From: Emily Shaffer @ 2019-09-05 19:39 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Jeff King
  Cc: git, Olga Telezhnaya, Christian Couder, Elijah Newren,
	Thomas Gummerer, Matheus Tavares Bernardino

On Wed, Sep 04, 2019 at 03:41:15PM -0400, Jeff King wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 27, 2019 at 01:17:57AM -0400, Jeff King wrote:
> 
> > Do we have interested mentors for the next round of Outreachy?
> > 
> > The deadline for Git to apply to the program is September 5th. The
> > deadline for mentors to have submitted project descriptions is September
> > 24th. Intern applications would start on October 1st.
> > 
> > If there are mentors who want to participate, I can handle the project
> > application and can start asking around for funding.
> 
> Funding is still up in the air, but in the meantime I've tentatively
> signed us up (we have until the 24th to have the funding committed).
> Next we need mentors to submit projects, as well as first-time
> contribution micro-projects.

I'm interested to mentor too, but I haven't done anything like this -
official mentoring, intern hosting, anything - so I will need to learn
:)

 - Emily

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

* Re: Git in Outreachy December 2019?
  2019-09-05 19:39   ` Emily Shaffer
@ 2019-09-06 11:55     ` Carlo Arenas
  2019-09-07  6:39       ` Jeff King
  2019-09-07  6:36     ` Jeff King
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 14+ messages in thread
From: Carlo Arenas @ 2019-09-06 11:55 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Emily Shaffer
  Cc: Jeff King, git, Olga Telezhnaya, Christian Couder, Elijah Newren,
	Thomas Gummerer, Matheus Tavares Bernardino

I'm interested to mentor/help too, but I am definitely not a (some
people would even argue against "reliable") contributor but I might be
better than nothing and could pass my "lessons learned" along, so
hopefully next contributors are less of a pain to deal with than I am

Carlo

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

* Re: Git in Outreachy December 2019?
  2019-09-05 19:39   ` Emily Shaffer
  2019-09-06 11:55     ` Carlo Arenas
@ 2019-09-07  6:36     ` Jeff King
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 14+ messages in thread
From: Jeff King @ 2019-09-07  6:36 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Emily Shaffer
  Cc: git, Olga Telezhnaya, Christian Couder, Elijah Newren,
	Thomas Gummerer, Matheus Tavares Bernardino

On Thu, Sep 05, 2019 at 12:39:59PM -0700, Emily Shaffer wrote:

> > Funding is still up in the air, but in the meantime I've tentatively
> > signed us up (we have until the 24th to have the funding committed).
> > Next we need mentors to submit projects, as well as first-time
> > contribution micro-projects.
> 
> I'm interested to mentor too, but I haven't done anything like this -
> official mentoring, intern hosting, anything - so I will need to learn
> :)

Great! I think a big challenge is coming up with an appropriately scoped
project for the intern. You can take a look at previous Outreachy and
GSoC proposals[1] to get the general idea, and then think about some
area you feel comfortable working in. You're welcome to send ideas or
drafts to the list to get feedback.

If you're feeling overwhelmed (or even if you're not), it might make
sense to try to partner with somebody else as a co-mentor, especially if
they've participated in the past. (It might also be that you can offer
to co-mentor with somebody else's project proposal).

-Peff

[1] Older materials can be found at https://git.github.io/, though
    these days the proposed projects go directly into the Outreachy
    system.

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

* Re: Git in Outreachy December 2019?
  2019-09-06 11:55     ` Carlo Arenas
@ 2019-09-07  6:39       ` Jeff King
  2019-09-07 10:13         ` Carlo Arenas
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 14+ messages in thread
From: Jeff King @ 2019-09-07  6:39 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Carlo Arenas
  Cc: Emily Shaffer, git, Olga Telezhnaya, Christian Couder,
	Elijah Newren, Thomas Gummerer, Matheus Tavares Bernardino

On Fri, Sep 06, 2019 at 04:55:46AM -0700, Carlo Arenas wrote:

> I'm interested to mentor/help too, but I am definitely not a (some
> people would even argue against "reliable") contributor but I might be
> better than nothing and could pass my "lessons learned" along, so
> hopefully next contributors are less of a pain to deal with than I am

I just wrote a response to Emily, but I think a lot of it applies to
you, as well.

In particular, I think both of you are a bit newer to the project than
most of the other people who have mentored in the past. In some ways
that may be a good thing, as it likely makes it easier to see things
from the intern's perspective. :) But it may also introduce some
complications if you're working in an area of the code you're not
familiar with. Co-mentoring may help with that.

-Peff

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

* Re: Git in Outreachy December 2019?
  2019-09-07  6:39       ` Jeff King
@ 2019-09-07 10:13         ` Carlo Arenas
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 14+ messages in thread
From: Carlo Arenas @ 2019-09-07 10:13 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Jeff King
  Cc: Emily Shaffer, git, Olga Telezhnaya, Christian Couder,
	Elijah Newren, Thomas Gummerer, Matheus Tavares Bernardino

On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 11:40 PM Jeff King <peff@peff.net> wrote:
>
> I just wrote a response to Emily, but I think a lot of it applies to
> you, as well.

With the exception of course that Emily can definitely write better
code than my attempted hacks

> In particular, I think both of you are a bit newer to the project than
> most of the other people who have mentored in the past. In some ways
> that may be a good thing, as it likely makes it easier to see things
> from the intern's perspective. :) But it may also introduce some
> complications if you're working in an area of the code you're not
> familiar with. Co-mentoring may help with that.

agree, and glad to help any way I can, specially if I can help offset
some of the boring work required that would free resources somewhere
else; then again by replying to Emily, I didn't meant we were both in
the same level both technically and resource wise (after all she wrote
the documentation on how to contribute and I only found a silly bug on
her code that will prevent really obsolete systems to compile and
didn't even wrote the patch)

Carlo

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

* Re: Git in Outreachy December 2019?
  2019-09-04 19:41 ` Jeff King
  2019-09-05  7:24   ` Christian Couder
  2019-09-05 19:39   ` Emily Shaffer
@ 2019-09-08 14:56   ` Pratyush Yadav
  2019-09-09 17:00     ` Jeff King
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 14+ messages in thread
From: Pratyush Yadav @ 2019-09-08 14:56 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Jeff King; +Cc: git

Hi Jeff,

On 04/09/19 03:41PM, Jeff King wrote:
[snip]
> The project page has a section to point people in the right direction
> for first-time contributions. I've left it blank for now, but I think it
> makes sense to point one (or both) of:
> 
>   - https://git-scm.com/docs/MyFirstContribution
> 
>   - https://matheustavares.gitlab.io/posts/first-steps-contributing-to-git
> 
> as well as a list of micro-projects (or at least instructions on how to
> find #leftoverbits, though we'd definitely have to step up our labeling,
> as I do not recall having seen one for a while).

I'd like to put out a proposal regarding first contributions and micro 
projects.

I have a small list of small isolated features and bug fixes that
_I think_ git-gui would benefit with. And other people using it can 
probably add their pet peeves and issues as well. My question is, are 
these something new contributors should try to work on as an 
introduction to the community? Since most of these features and fixes 
are small and isolated, they should be pretty easy to work on. And I 
think people generally find UI apps a little easier to work on.

But I'll play the devil's advocate on my proposal and point out some 
problems/flaws:
- Git-gui is written in Tcl, and git in C (and other languages too, but 
  not Tcl). That means while people do get a feel of the community and 
  general workflow, they don't necessarily get a feel of the actual git 
  internal codebase.
- Since I don't see a git-gui related project worth being into the 
  Outreachy program, it essentially means they will likely not work on 
  anything related to their project.
- Git-gui is essentially a wrapper on top of git, so people won't get 
  exposure to the git internals.

I'd like to hear your and the rest of the community's thoughts about 
this proposal, and whether it will be a good idea or not.

If people do like this idea, I can do a write up on "things to fix in 
git-gui" that people can add to (and they get a chance to call me stupid 
for even thinking feature X is a good idea ;)).

-- 
Regards,
Pratyush Yadav

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

* Re: Git in Outreachy December 2019?
  2019-09-08 14:56   ` Pratyush Yadav
@ 2019-09-09 17:00     ` Jeff King
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 14+ messages in thread
From: Jeff King @ 2019-09-09 17:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Pratyush Yadav; +Cc: git

On Sun, Sep 08, 2019 at 08:26:10PM +0530, Pratyush Yadav wrote:

> I'd like to put out a proposal regarding first contributions and micro 
> projects.
> 
> I have a small list of small isolated features and bug fixes that
> _I think_ git-gui would benefit with. And other people using it can 
> probably add their pet peeves and issues as well. My question is, are 
> these something new contributors should try to work on as an 
> introduction to the community? Since most of these features and fixes 
> are small and isolated, they should be pretty easy to work on. And I 
> think people generally find UI apps a little easier to work on.
> 
> But I'll play the devil's advocate on my proposal and point out some 
> problems/flaws:
> - Git-gui is written in Tcl, and git in C (and other languages too, but 
>   not Tcl). That means while people do get a feel of the community and 
>   general workflow, they don't necessarily get a feel of the actual git 
>   internal codebase.
> - Since I don't see a git-gui related project worth being into the 
>   Outreachy program, it essentially means they will likely not work on 
>   anything related to their project.
> - Git-gui is essentially a wrapper on top of git, so people won't get 
>   exposure to the git internals.
> 
> I'd like to hear your and the rest of the community's thoughts about 
> this proposal, and whether it will be a good idea or not.

Right, I came up with similar devil's advocate arguments. :) I'm not
totally opposed, because part of the point of these microprojects just
getting people familiar with interacting with the community and
submitting a patch. They're not always in the same area the intern
intends to work, just because there's not always a trivial problem to be
solved there.

So we do look at it mostly as a "can you do this basic test" test, and
not necessarily as a prelude to the project.

But it would be nice if it were at least in the same _language_ that the
ultimate project will be done in. Because we're evaluating the
applicant's ability to write code in that language, too.

So I dunno. I am on the fence.

-Peff

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

* Re: Git in Outreachy December 2019?
  2019-08-27  5:17 Git in Outreachy December 2019? Jeff King
  2019-08-31  7:58 ` Christian Couder
  2019-09-04 19:41 ` Jeff King
@ 2019-09-13 20:03 ` Jonathan Tan
  2019-09-13 20:51   ` Jeff King
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 14+ messages in thread
From: Jonathan Tan @ 2019-09-13 20:03 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: peff; +Cc: git, Jonathan Tan

> Do we have interested mentors for the next round of Outreachy?
> 
> The deadline for Git to apply to the program is September 5th. The
> deadline for mentors to have submitted project descriptions is September
> 24th. Intern applications would start on October 1st.
> 
> If there are mentors who want to participate, I can handle the project
> application and can start asking around for funding.

I probably should have replied earlier, but if Git has applied to the
program, feel free to include me as a mentor.

There was a discussion about mentors/co-mentors possibly working in a
part of a codebase that they are not familiar with [1] - firstly, I
think that's possible and even likely for most of us. :-) If any
question arises, maybe it would be sufficient for the mentors to just
help formulate the question (or pose the question themselves) to the
mailing list. If "[Outreachy]" appears in the subject, I'll make it a
higher priority for myself to answer those.

[1] https://public-inbox.org/git/20190907063958.GB28860@sigill.intra.peff.net/

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

* Re: Git in Outreachy December 2019?
  2019-09-13 20:03 ` Jonathan Tan
@ 2019-09-13 20:51   ` Jeff King
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 14+ messages in thread
From: Jeff King @ 2019-09-13 20:51 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Jonathan Tan; +Cc: git

On Fri, Sep 13, 2019 at 01:03:17PM -0700, Jonathan Tan wrote:

> > Do we have interested mentors for the next round of Outreachy?
> > 
> > The deadline for Git to apply to the program is September 5th. The
> > deadline for mentors to have submitted project descriptions is September
> > 24th. Intern applications would start on October 1st.
> > 
> > If there are mentors who want to participate, I can handle the project
> > application and can start asking around for funding.
> 
> I probably should have replied earlier, but if Git has applied to the
> program, feel free to include me as a mentor.

Great!  See my followup here:

  https://public-inbox.org/git/20190904194114.GA31398@sigill.intra.peff.net/

Prospective mentors need to sign up on that site, and should propose a
project they'd be willing to mentor.

> There was a discussion about mentors/co-mentors possibly working in a
> part of a codebase that they are not familiar with [1] - firstly, I
> think that's possible and even likely for most of us. :-) If any
> question arises, maybe it would be sufficient for the mentors to just
> help formulate the question (or pose the question themselves) to the
> mailing list. If "[Outreachy]" appears in the subject, I'll make it a
> higher priority for myself to answer those.

I do think it's OK for mentors to not be intimately familiar with the
part of the code that is being touched, as long as the project is simple
enough that they can pick up the technical details easily as-needed. A
lot of what mentors will help mentees with is the overall process (both
Git-specific parts, but also more general development issues). But I
think the proposed projects do need to be feasible.

I'm happy to discuss possible projects if anybody has an idea but isn't
sure how to develop it into a proposal.

-Peff

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 14+ messages in thread

end of thread, back to index

Thread overview: 14+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2019-08-27  5:17 Git in Outreachy December 2019? Jeff King
2019-08-31  7:58 ` Christian Couder
2019-08-31 19:44   ` Olga Telezhnaya
2019-09-04 19:41 ` Jeff King
2019-09-05  7:24   ` Christian Couder
2019-09-05 19:39   ` Emily Shaffer
2019-09-06 11:55     ` Carlo Arenas
2019-09-07  6:39       ` Jeff King
2019-09-07 10:13         ` Carlo Arenas
2019-09-07  6:36     ` Jeff King
2019-09-08 14:56   ` Pratyush Yadav
2019-09-09 17:00     ` Jeff King
2019-09-13 20:03 ` Jonathan Tan
2019-09-13 20:51   ` Jeff King

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